+ Reply to Thread
Page 84 of 84
FirstFirst ... 34 74 82 83 84
Results 831 to 839 of 839

Thread: Check this out read from the bottom up ...Audatex at it's finest

  1. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ma.
    Posts
    435

    Quote,

    "There is a set of laws that do apply."

    Yes, I use a set of laws in my state that allows me to determine and set my price as an independent businessman!

  2. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,283

    ....some more thoughts

    Bill, your statement is as good a brief analysis as I have seen. As you step away from the day-to-day interaction, focus is better.

    If things continue as is I feel the insurers will pull back from the direct controls over the market for the simple reason the DRP model controls the major markets and indirectly all others, and that control over repairers is a deadly threat to insurers because of the methods used in building the DRP model. That is, the DRP model (including all he insurer established controls) will maintain the established distribution of market share in total and compete at that level among one another for local share. Also, insurers will continue to move away from actual estimating, and put in place an overall, central mining of each DRP and other estimates using accumulated data to determine the pricing that the insurer will be able, correct or not, to defend as market determined. They cannot remove themselves completely from the pricing matrix they established, but that can shift more of the burden to the DRP as the one who makes the pricing decisions. (one weakness to that is that the DRP just might wake up and realize they are in the driver's seat)

    I think a significant weakness to the scheme is the belief insurers have developed that they can make decisions that are outside the policy limits, reserved for the property owner. But most significant even if they had the full authority over the vehicle, the insurance industry has established a pricing matrix through the use of the data provider as a vehicle, and as you state, supported by repairers that defied market competition in interstate commerce. As insurers move away from direct control over market distribution, it will lessen the threat to them of the exploitation of repairers.

    (Speaking of exploitation, yes the consumer has been exploited as a result of the cooperative effort between insurers and those that cooperated in the scheme. But make no mistake, the entire program was directed at the repairer; an industry. The consumer's losses are individual, and proof of damage across a wide swath of consumers will be long and tortuous as has been shown time and time again. Sensational cases like the glued on roof are exceptional in their rarity and cause a lot of focus, but taking up the consumer gauntlet only diverts) The DRP is in the direct line not the insurer). To believe otherwise is folly. On a scale that might challenge insurer practices, it has to come from repairers, and those repairers must be able to fully and completely support their damages. I haven't seen a repairer that can do that and prevail. Insurers are very good at settling cases, and occasion fighting in the courts for decades (Avery). Neither will gain any ground for the repair industry; unless the Feds step in and that is a two edged sword and unlikely. States? No way.

    Another targeted outflow of insurer controls is the reduced number of and size of the more independent repairer that might challenge the insurer for their actions in controlling market share and pricing. There is the potential that some DRP might have a "come to Jesus" moment and take them on once they recognize their leverage and what they have paid and continue to pay to compete with their benefactor, the insurer.

    Repairers generally think about today and how to make each estimate work. Insurers embarked on a decades long program to get to where they are, and where they are going.

    My opinions.
    Last edited by Roy Smalley; 10-27-2017 at 09:30 AM.
    Roy Smalley,
    Texas

  3. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Southaven, Mississippi
    Posts
    770

    The government will never step in to do anything that is in the best interest of consumers unless it the political capital benefit would exceed political contributions from the insurance industry. I remember when John Eaves and I went knocking on doors in D.C., trying to gin up some interest in enforcing the 1963 Consent Decree. Most Senators and Congressmen would't even meet with us and the ones that did just nodded like the little toy dogs on the package tray of the car, anticipating the moment we would leave. The best actor was Roger Wicker. He intently listened to what we had to say, occasionally leaned to his assistant, instructing her to "look into that", while looking for excuses why the senate should not intercede in what is traditionally the bailiwick of the states. I made the point that the Decree was important enough for the Attorney General to draft the Decree, so precedent has already been established. I also asked if the Senate did not also regulate interstate commerce, which he conceded they do. I made the observation that insurer practices that adversely affect consumers cross state lines, therefore constituting interstate commerce. He agreed, but made it clear he was through discussing the matter.

    You are right, Roy, that insurance companies will occasionally write a check to settle issues they do not want to get to the courtroom, but they will fight to the death on any issue that threatens to expose their tactics or has the potential to establish a game changing legal precedent. The best part of the whole scheme is that they have created the illusion that shops establish the pricing matrix, holding all in the industry, DRP participants or not, in a perpetual state of subjugation. As an added bonus, shops hold all the liability for following insurer direction, because they are the "collision repair experts". Only when shops wake up and see others driven out of business, will they realize they only have 2 choices, repair a car correctly and charge accordingly or wait their turn to fall victim to the insurer scam. Either choice has the potential to put a small shop out of business, one choice maintaining some degree of dignity and at least a fighting chance, the other does not. Unfortunately, I have no confidence that most will choose the first option. It's like being addicted to a drug, where the fear of the cure exceeds the fear of continuing to do something that will sooner or later lead to your complete ruin or death.

  4. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,283

    Good job Bill.............
    Roy Smalley,
    Texas

  5. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Southaven, Mississippi
    Posts
    770

    Unfortunately Roy, those of us making the observations here least need the information. Those who need it most either don't make any attempt to look beyond the boundaries of their own little circle or don't have the courage or good sense to heed it when they solicit it. I let a shop cry on my shoulder for over an hour last week, complaining about all the issues shops have complained about for decades. This was a local shop that called me, knowing that when I was their competitor, I collected higher rates for all labor categories, materials, storage charges, and got paid for operations no one else in my market got paid for. They wanted to know how and I told them I did it by making it cheaper for the insurance company to pay me what I wanted than to deal with the fallout of what I would do if they did not. I booted cars from the lot and cleaned their clocks with admin and storage charges, all the while exposing the insurance company's tactics to the customer. Everybody knew about the sign that hung on my office wall, advising potential customers of insurance companies I refused to do business with. When asked, I would tell the customer in great detail why a particular name was there. Insurance companies thought my sign funny at first but no longer found it amusing when people began to change insurance companies because of it. This shop had known all this for years but would never do it too.

    I sent the shop a copy of the consumer guide recently released by Mississippi's Attorney General, telling them to read it thoroughly and call me back once they had. When they called back, I told them they had the silver bullet in their hands and explained how. The guide makes it clear that the shop is compelled by law to provide a proper repair and they should take advantage of it, by highlighting that language and show it to the customer. Then write their own estimate, following OEM repair procedure to the letter,providing copies of OEM procedure and once again explaining that they are required to by law to provide a proper repair, being defined as following OEM procedure. Then make the case that they are not willing to break the law to save the insurance company money, compromise passenger safety and expose themselves to liability.

    Put the insurance company in the position of making the customer believe that you are wrong when the customer has the evidence in their hands to the contrary. But before the customer leaves your office, hand them a copy of a guarantee that if you repair the vehicle, you will follow the consumer guide and OEM repair procedure to the letter, making the observation that you are the only shop in thee area willing to offer such a guarantee. Once you get the customer on your side, you can charge whatever you want and the insurance company has no effective way to fight back unless they can convince the customer to take their car to a shop that is willing to break the law, compromising the integrity of the repair to save the insurance company money. Do you think they even tried that approach? Not on your life and you have to ask yourself why.

  6. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ma.
    Posts
    435

    I told a shop about how to get paid for the work that he does and his reply was,

    "WELL WE MAKE OUT OK, WE JUST DO WHAT THEY SAY AND DON'T ARGUE."

    "If we complain we will lose work and we rely on them for our jobs."

    What ever happened to doing a good job and rely on word of mouth for work like any other business?

    When you write an est, (if anyone does that now) and then agree to a lower price, what does that tell everybody about your est? ( To me, that says that you are either trying to cheat them out of money in the first place, or you are going to cheat them out of quality in the second place.)

    On another note, I wonder how many hits this site gets compared to responses.

  7. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Southaven, Mississippi
    Posts
    770

    I have a feeling we are now preaching to the choir, as we say in the South. Our discussion is likely read by few anymore and my question is, are we that smart or is everyone else that damn stupid? They constantly profess to seek answers but then don't want to hear them, even if it can be proven to work. I always felt like if what I am doing ain't working, I'm all ears.

  8. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ma.
    Posts
    435

    I think that you are right about preaching to the choir, so I went to the congregation, (autobodyonline) and I noticed that there were only about 8 posts in 2017 so far.

    I guess even they realize that no one is listening.

  9. Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Southaven, Mississippi
    Posts
    770

    Unfortunately, Facebook seems to be the go to forum for too many people these days. I closed my account over 2 years ago when Facebook refused to take down a picture depicting a police officer being beheaded by a masked terrorist and vowed I would never go back, so I have no idea what sort of information may be shared there now. At the time I left, there were a couple of private industry forums but there were few members, consisting of only people who were invited and trusted not to give information to "The Dark Side". Needless to say, those participating needed the information presented the least.

    All the information anyone should need is readily available but, as is usually the case, few have the good sense to do what they must. It is really very simple and consistent with what the CCRE has preached for years:
    1. Determine what YOUR cost of doing business is and set your rates accordingly.
    2. Never forget that the customer is the customer, not just a bystander, and the insurance company is not. Do not negotiate with the insurance company. That's the customer's responsibility.
    3. A recent legal settlement makes it very clear that there is only one correct way to repair a vehicle and that is according to OEM standards, not an insurance company's.
    4. The insurance company has no standing in the contract of repair between the customer and the shop, their purpose is to REIMBURSE the customer for costs incurred, not dictate repair cost and procedure.
    5. Last and most important, the shop holds all the liability if the vehicle is not properly repaired, "properly" being defined as following OEM procedure.

    That is all anyone needs to know. To do otherwise ensures the shop will not be around much longer. and could forfeit everything they own before they leave.

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts